Флот в межвоенный период, часть I

[Vova7]

Рионы около 7 миллионов получаются, а Яростные как Новики реала.. А вот по ПЛ не знаю

[Good]

Броненосные крейсера типа «Рюрик»

...

Для решения каких задач строились эти корабли?

Они же по бронированию и вооружению значительно уступают даже тем британским БрКр (типов “Блэк Принс”, “Уорриор” и “Минотор”), которые были заложены гораздо раньше их!?

Крейсера типа «Рион»

...

Скорость хода?

Донской - ноябрь 1913 года

За счёт чего такой короткий срок постройки?

Рионы около 7 миллионов получаются...

У Вас есть sharp'овский расчет "Риона"?

[Doctor Haider]

Скорость хода?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

26 уз.

[Vova7]

У Вас есть sharp'овский расчет "Риона"?

Рион МЦМ-7, Российская Империя Легкий крейсер laid down 1907 (Engine 1906)

Displacement:

4 042 t light; 4 258 t standard; 4 740 t normal; 5 126 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)

(448,80 ft / 442,91 ft) x 49,21 ft x (16,40 / 17,37 ft)

(136,79 m / 135,00 m) x 15,00 m x (5,00 / 5,29 m)

Armament:

10 - 4,72" / 120 mm 50,0 cal guns - 55,82lbs / 25,32kg shells, 300 per gun

Quick firing guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1907 Model

3 x 2-gun mounts on centreline ends, majority aft

2 x 2-gun mounts on sides amidships

4 - 2,95" / 75,0 mm 40,0 cal guns - 12,34lbs / 5,60kg shells, 1 000 per gun

Quick firing guns in deck and hoist mounts, 1907 Model

4 x Single mounts on sides amidships

Weight of broadside 608 lbs / 276 kg

Armour:

- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)

Main: 2,48" / 63 mm 262,47 ft / 80,00 m 9,19 ft / 2,80 m

Ends: 0,98" / 25 mm 164,04 ft / 50,00 m 9,19 ft / 2,80 m

16,40 ft / 5,00 m Unarmoured ends

Main Belt covers 91% of normal length

Main belt does not fully cover magazines and engineering spaces

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)

Main: 0,79" / 20 mm 0,20" / 5 mm 0,98" / 25 mm

- Protected deck - single deck: 0,98" / 25 mm For and Aft decks

Forecastle: 0,98" / 25 mm Quarter deck: 0,98" / 25 mm

- Conning towers: Forward 1,97" / 50 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm

Machinery:

Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,

Direct drive, 2 shafts, 25 889 shp / 19 313 Kw = 26,00 kts

Range 4 000nm at 12,00 kts

Bunker at max displacement = 869 tons (50% coal)

Complement:

285 - 371

Cost:

£0,452 million / $1,807 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:

Armament: 193 tons, 4,1%

Armour: 611 tons, 12,9%

- Belts: 306 tons, 6,4%

- Armament: 36 tons, 0,8%

- Armour Deck: 258 tons, 5,4%

- Conning Tower: 12 tons, 0,3%

Machinery: 1 761 tons, 37,1%

Hull, fittings & equipment: 1 465 tons, 30,9%

Fuel, ammunition & stores: 698 tons, 14,7%

Miscellaneous weights: 12 tons, 0,3%

- On freeboard deck: 12 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:

Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):

2 909 lbs / 1 319 Kg = 55,2 x 4,7 " / 120 mm shells or 0,7 torpedoes

Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,19

Metacentric height 2,4 ft / 0,7 m

Roll period: 13,3 seconds

Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 91 %

- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,26

Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,12

Hull form characteristics:

Hull has rise forward of midbreak,

a normal bow and a round stern

Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,464 / 0,474

Length to Beam Ratio: 9,00 : 1

'Natural speed' for length: 21,05 kts

Power going to wave formation at top speed: 52 %

Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 81

Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10,00 degrees

Stern overhang: 3,28 ft / 1,00 m

Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):

Fore end, Aft end

- Forecastle: 30,00%, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m

- Forward deck: 10,00%, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m

- Aft deck: 45,00%, 11,48 ft / 3,50 m, 11,48 ft / 3,50 m

- Quarter deck: 15,00%, 11,48 ft / 3,50 m, 11,48 ft / 3,50 m

- Average freeboard: 12,80 ft / 3,90 m

Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:

Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 134,3%

- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 113,4%

Waterplane Area: 14 067 Square feet or 1 307 Square metres

Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 100%

Structure weight / hull surface area: 74 lbs/sq ft or 362 Kg/sq metre

Hull strength (Relative):

- Cross-sectional: 0,99

- Longitudinal: 1,12

- Overall: 1,00

Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped

Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate

Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

скрыть

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Они же по бронированию и вооружению значительно уступают даже тем британским БрКр (типов “Блэк Принс”, “Уорриор” и “Минотор”), которые были заложены гораздо раньше их!?

ну вообщем и Баяны реала тоже были всех слабей... а указанные вами английские крейсера как бы не в полтора раза больше нашего Рюрика, так что его надо сравнивать не с Уорииором, а хотя бы с Кентом...

[SergeyM]

У Вас есть sharp'овский расчет "Риона"?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

у меня в шарпе он вообще не выходит. слишком тесный корпус и места для машин и запаса топлива нет. стоит 1.65 мегабакса.

[Vova7]

у меня в шарпе он вообще не выходит. слишком тесный корпус

а с этим для небольших кораблей придется смириться - попробуйте тот же Каледон британский сделать...

[Good]

Рион МЦМ-7, Российская Империя Легкий крейсер laid down 1907 (Engine 1906)

Спасибо.

... и Баяны реала тоже были всех слабей...

Понятно.

Вы создали “улучшенный”, по сравнению с проектом Виноградова-Cobra, “Баян”, при этом, правда, водоизмещение корабля возросло на 30 %, стоимость более чем на 2 млн. руб., а вес бортового залпа увеличился всего на 260 кГ!

у меня в шарпе он вообще не выходит.

Так он и у автора не выходит – “Main belt does not fully cover magazines and engineering spaces” и “Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped”!!!

а с этим для небольших кораблей придется смириться - попробуйте тот же Каледон британский сделать...

???

Пожалуйста.

Caledon, HMS cruiser laid down 1916

Displacement:

3 421 t light; 3 599 t standard; 4 120 t normal; 4 536 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)

(455,41 ft / 450,13 ft) x 42,65 ft x (17,87 / 19,09 ft)

(138,81 m / 137,20 m) x 13,00 m x (5,45 / 5,82 m)

Armament:

5 - 5,98" / 152 mm 45,0 cal guns - 108,07lbs / 49,02kg shells, 250 per gun

Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1916 Model

5 x 2-gun mounts on centreline, evenly spread

2 - 2,99" / 76,0 mm 20,0 cal guns - 12,01lbs / 5,45kg shells, 300 per gun

Anti-air guns in deck mounts, 1916 Model

2 x Single mounts on sides amidships

4 - 1,85" / 47,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 3,19lbs / 1,45kg shells, 500 per gun

Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1916 Model

4 x Single mounts on sides amidships

Weight of broadside 577 lbs / 262 kg

8 - 21,0" / 533 mm, 26,25 ft / 8,00 m torpedoes - 1,654 t each, 13,232 t total

In 4 sets of deck mounted side rotating tubes

Armour:

- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)

Main: 2,95" / 75 mm 328,08 ft / 100,00 m 6,56 ft / 2,00 m

Ends: 1,18" / 30 mm 98,43 ft / 30,00 m 6,56 ft / 2,00 m

23,62 ft / 7,20 m Unarmoured ends

Main Belt covers 112% of normal length

- Protected deck - single deck: 0,98" / 25 mm For and Aft decks

Forecastle: 0,98" / 25 mm Quarter deck: 0,98" / 25 mm

- Conning towers: Forward 5,98" / 152 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm

Machinery:

Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,

Geared drive, 2 shafts, 35 186 shp / 26 249 Kw = 29,00 kts

Range 4 600nm at 16,00 kts

Bunker at max displacement = 937 tons

Complement:

256 - 334

Cost:

?0,540 million / $2,160 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:

Armament: 110 tons, 2,7%

- Guns: 97 tons, 2,4%

- Torpedoes: 13 tons, 0,3%

Armour: 534 tons, 13,0%

- Belts: 281 tons, 6,8%

- Armour Deck: 219 tons, 5,3%

- Conning Tower: 33 tons, 0,8%

Machinery: 1 311 tons, 31,8%

Hull, fittings & equipment: 1 466 tons, 35,6%

Fuel, ammunition & stores: 699 tons, 17,0%

Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:

Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):

3 931 lbs / 1 783 Kg = 36,7 x 6,0 " / 152 mm shells or 0,9 torpedoes

Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,27

Metacentric height 2,1 ft / 0,7 m

Roll period: 12,2 seconds

Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %

- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,17

Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,39

Hull form characteristics:

Hull has raised forecastle,

a normal bow and a round stern

Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,420 / 0,433

Length to Beam Ratio: 10,55 : 1

'Natural speed' for length: 21,22 kts

Power going to wave formation at top speed: 54 %

Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50

Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 15,00 degrees

Stern overhang: -3,28 ft / -1,00 m

Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):

Fore end, Aft end

- Forecastle: 40,00%, 19,69 ft / 6,00 m, 19,69 ft / 6,00 m

- Forward deck: 10,00%, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m

- Aft deck: 40,00%, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m

- Quarter deck: 10,00%, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m

- Average freeboard: 15,75 ft / 4,80 m

Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:

Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 111,1%

- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 111,0%

Waterplane Area: 11 971 Square feet or 1 112 Square metres

Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 121%

Structure weight / hull surface area: 69 lbs/sq ft or 339 Kg/sq metre

Hull strength (Relative):

- Cross-sectional: 0,99

- Longitudinal: 1,91

- Overall: 1,06

Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate

Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate

Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

скрыть

[SergeyM]

так Каледон 1916-го года. у него машина меньше 40 кг на л.с. вестит

[komo]

Рюрик и ослябля слишком модерновые корабли выходят на 1906г, да и с мощными турбинами у парсона завал, то что может призвести идет на английские линейные крейсера, а менее мощные надо будет по несколько штук на вал ставить. По закладкак оптимально так, два андрей-мичиганыча в 1905г, к 1909-10г в строй, на 1906-1907г морвед захочет 2 бркр в 15-20кт с 2*3 или 4*2 10"-12", турбинами и скоростью не ниже 23уз, а лучше 25уз, но минфин обрежет, и заложат эрзацы до 10кт и с 8" артиллерией. А по линкорам, закладывать каждый год с 1909г по два линкора на балтике и одному на чм, с унификацией брони, башен, механизмов, ну а в качестве бонуса вооружить их 34-35см\45 орудием. Так можно будет иметь в 15г на балтике-северном море 8 сверхдредноутов и 4 на чм. + два ранних дредноута и кучу броненосцев. Программа выглядит вполне реально и по финансам и по времени. 100мил руб в 1909-1913г на 1. балтийскую дивизию, 100-110 мил в 1909-1915г на черноморскую дивизию, и 120 мил в 1911-1915г на 2ю серию балтийских линкоров. Разработку орудия заказать в 1907г, а начать производить броню и часть механизмов еще до закладки линкоров.

[Good]

так Каледон 1916-го года. у него машина меньше 40 кг на л.с. вестит

Естественно. Но тезис Vova7 о том, что "с этим для небольших кораблей придется смириться" - неверен.

А на "Рионах" при водоизмещении 4700 Т разместить ЭУ мощностью 26 тыс. л. с. просто невозможно.

[SergeyM]

на Рионах закладки 1907-го года....

[Vova7]

Но тезис Vova7 о том, что "с этим для небольших кораблей придется смириться" - неверен.

хорошо, для небольших кораблей закладки до 1914 года с требуемыми характеристиками..

А на "Рионах" при водоизмещении 4700 Т разместить ЭУ мощностью 26 тыс. л. с. просто невозможно.

Ваши предложения?

[Good]

хорошо, для небольших кораблей закладки до 1914 года с требуемыми характеристиками..

Что значит "с требуемыми"? С реальными характеристиками Sharp работает вполне корректно.

Ваши предложения?

Увеличить водоизмещение "Рионов".

[SergeyM]

А ежели вот так?

Rion, Russia Cruiser laid down 1907

Displacement:

5 255 t light; 5 474 t standard; 6 000 t normal; 6 421 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)

(446,19 ft / 446,19 ft) x 49,21 ft x (17,39 / 18,35 ft)

(136,00 m / 136,00 m) x 15,00 m x (5,30 / 5,59 m)

Armament:

10 - 4,72" / 120 mm 50,0 cal guns - 55,82lbs / 25,32kg shells, 300 per gun

Quick firing guns in deck and hoist mounts, 1907 Model

3 x 2-gun mounts on centreline ends, majority aft

2 x 2-gun mounts on sides amidships

4 - 1,46" / 37,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 1,56lbs / 0,71kg shells, 600 per gun

Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1907 Model

4 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread

Weight of broadside 564 lbs / 256 kg

4 - 18,0" / 457 mm, 19,69 ft / 6,00 m torpedoes - 0,923 t each, 3,690 t total

In 2 sets of deck mounted carriage/fixed tubes

Armour:

- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)

Main: 2,48" / 63 mm 328,08 ft / 100,00 m 7,87 ft / 2,40 m

Ends: 0,98" / 25 mm 98,43 ft / 30,00 m 7,87 ft / 2,40 m

19,69 ft / 6,00 m Unarmoured ends

Main Belt covers 113% of normal length

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)

Main: 1,97" / 50 mm 1,97" / 50 mm -

- Box over machinery & magazines: 1,50" / 38 mm

Forecastle: 1,50" / 38 mm Quarter deck: 1,50" / 38 mm

- Conning towers: Forward 2,01" / 51 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm

Machinery:

Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,

No drive to shaft, 3 shafts, 30 973 shp / 23 106 Kw = 26,00 kts

Range 4 000nm at 12,00 kts

Bunker at max displacement = 947 tons (50% coal)

Complement:

340 - 443

Cost:

?0,502 million / $2,007 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:

Armament: 173 tons, 2,9%

- Guns: 170 tons, 2,8%

- Torpedoes: 4 tons, 0,1%

Armour: 1 020 tons, 17,0%

- Belts: 289 tons, 4,8%

- Armament: 75 tons, 1,2%

- Armour Deck: 642 tons, 10,7%

- Conning Tower: 14 tons, 0,2%

Machinery: 1 844 tons, 30,7%

Hull, fittings & equipment: 2 218 tons, 37,0%

Fuel, ammunition & stores: 745 tons, 12,4%

Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:

Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):

5 913 lbs / 2 682 Kg = 112,1 x 4,7 " / 120 mm shells or 1,0 torpedoes

Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,29

Metacentric height 2,7 ft / 0,8 m

Roll period: 12,6 seconds

Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 62 %

- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,21

Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,24

Hull form characteristics:

Hull has raised forecastle,

a normal bow and a cruiser stern

Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,550 / 0,558

Length to Beam Ratio: 9,07 : 1

'Natural speed' for length: 21,12 kts

Power going to wave formation at top speed: 55 %

Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50

Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees

Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m

Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):

Fore end, Aft end

- Forecastle: 20,00%, 22,97 ft / 7,00 m, 22,97 ft / 7,00 m

- Forward deck: 30,00%, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m

- Aft deck: 30,00%, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m

- Quarter deck: 20,00%, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m

- Average freeboard: 16,67 ft / 5,08 m

Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:

Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 109,9%

- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 128,6%

Waterplane Area: 15 325 Square feet or 1 424 Square metres

Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 114%

Structure weight / hull surface area: 93 lbs/sq ft or 455 Kg/sq metre

Hull strength (Relative):

- Cross-sectional: 1,20

- Longitudinal: 1,82

- Overall: 1,25

Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate

Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent

Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

скрыть

[Good]

"No drive to shaft" - ?

Вес ЭУ должен быть больше 2,5 тыс. Т.

[SergeyM]

в данном случае привод на массу не вилияет. поставил "директ драйв" - все то же самое.

Вес ЭУ должен быть больше 2,5 тыс. Т.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

более 80 кг на л.с.?

[Good]

На "Инвинсиблах" - 82 кГ/л. с., а на "Севастополях" вообще около 90.

[SergeyM]

вот с 25 узлами и 600 тонн доп. веса навесил.

Rion, Russia Cruiser laid down 1907

Displacement:

5 255 t light; 5 474 t standard; 6 000 t normal; 6 421 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)

(452,35 ft / 446,19 ft) x 49,21 ft x (17,39 / 18,35 ft)

(137,88 m / 136,00 m) x 15,00 m x (5,30 / 5,59 m)

Armament:

10 - 4,72" / 120 mm 50,0 cal guns - 55,82lbs / 25,32kg shells, 300 per gun

Quick firing guns in deck and hoist mounts, 1907 Model

3 x 2-gun mounts on centreline ends, majority aft

2 x 2-gun mounts on sides amidships

4 - 1,46" / 37,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 1,56lbs / 0,71kg shells, 600 per gun

Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1907 Model

4 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread

Weight of broadside 564 lbs / 256 kg

4 - 18,0" / 457 mm, 19,69 ft / 6,00 m torpedoes - 0,923 t each, 3,690 t total

In 2 sets of deck mounted carriage/fixed tubes

Armour:

- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)

Main: 2,48" / 63 mm 328,08 ft / 100,00 m 7,87 ft / 2,40 m

Ends: 0,98" / 25 mm 98,43 ft / 30,00 m 7,87 ft / 2,40 m

19,69 ft / 6,00 m Unarmoured ends

Main Belt covers 113% of normal length

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)

Main: 1,97" / 50 mm 1,97" / 50 mm -

- Box over machinery & magazines: 1,50" / 38 mm

Forecastle: 1,50" / 38 mm Quarter deck: 1,50" / 38 mm

- Conning towers: Forward 2,01" / 51 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm

Machinery:

Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,

Direct drive, 3 shafts, 26 470 shp / 19 746 Kw = 25,00 kts

Range 4 000nm at 12,00 kts

Bunker at max displacement = 947 tons (50% coal)

Complement:

340 - 443

Cost:

?0,464 million / $1,857 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:

Armament: 173 tons, 2,9%

- Guns: 170 tons, 2,8%

- Torpedoes: 4 tons, 0,1%

Armour: 1 084 tons, 18,1%

- Belts: 289 tons, 4,8%

- Armament: 75 tons, 1,2%

- Armour Deck: 706 tons, 11,8%

- Conning Tower: 14 tons, 0,2%

Machinery: 1 576 tons, 26,3%

Hull, fittings & equipment: 1 823 tons, 30,4%

Fuel, ammunition & stores: 745 tons, 12,4%

Miscellaneous weights: 600 tons, 10,0%

- Hull below water: 600 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:

Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):

6 467 lbs / 2 933 Kg = 122,7 x 4,7 " / 120 mm shells or 1,1 torpedoes

Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,34

Metacentric height 2,9 ft / 0,9 m

Roll period: 12,1 seconds

Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 73 %

- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,22

Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,47

Hull form characteristics:

Hull has raised forecastle,

a normal bow and a cruiser stern

Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,550 / 0,558

Length to Beam Ratio: 9,07 : 1

'Natural speed' for length: 21,12 kts

Power going to wave formation at top speed: 53 %

Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50

Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 15,00 degrees

Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m

Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):

Fore end, Aft end

- Forecastle: 25,00%, 22,97 ft / 7,00 m, 22,97 ft / 7,00 m

- Forward deck: 30,00%, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m

- Aft deck: 25,00%, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m

- Quarter deck: 20,00%, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m

- Average freeboard: 17,06 ft / 5,20 m

Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:

Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 106,3%

- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 128,6%

Waterplane Area: 15 325 Square feet or 1 424 Square metres

Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 111%

Structure weight / hull surface area: 76 lbs/sq ft or 372 Kg/sq metre

Hull strength (Relative):

- Cross-sectional: 0,99

- Longitudinal: 1,58

- Overall: 1,04

Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate

Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent

Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

скрыть

[Vova7]

Displacement:

5 255 t light; 5 474 t standard; 6 000 t normal; 6 421 t full load

чорд, но тогда это вообще не скаут ни разу

а как же тогда Гаврилов свои ТТХ прописывал?

[SergeyM]

резать дальность. снимать броню. позже закладывать.

[SergeyM]

Вот он 1910-го года закладки с машиной 1908-го года и 600 тоннами доп нагрузки для приведения массы машин в норму.

Rion, Russia Cruiser laid down 1910 (Engine 1908)

Displacement:

4 514 t light; 4 715 t standard; 5 106 t normal; 5 418 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)

(452,35 ft / 446,19 ft) x 49,21 ft x (17,39 / 18,16 ft)

(137,88 m / 136,00 m) x 15,00 m x (5,30 / 5,53 m)

Armament:

10 - 4,72" / 120 mm 50,0 cal guns - 55,82lbs / 25,32kg shells, 300 per gun

Quick firing guns in deck and hoist mounts, 1910 Model

3 x 2-gun mounts on centreline ends, majority aft

2 x 2-gun mounts on sides amidships

4 - 1,46" / 37,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 1,56lbs / 0,71kg shells, 600 per gun

Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1910 Model

4 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread

Weight of broadside 564 lbs / 256 kg

4 - 18,0" / 457 mm, 19,69 ft / 6,00 m torpedoes - 0,935 t each, 3,738 t total

In 2 sets of deck mounted carriage/fixed tubes

Armour:

- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)

Main: 2,48" / 63 mm 328,08 ft / 100,00 m 7,87 ft / 2,40 m

Ends: 0,98" / 25 mm 98,43 ft / 30,00 m 7,87 ft / 2,40 m

19,69 ft / 6,00 m Unarmoured ends

Main Belt covers 113% of normal length

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)

Main: 1,97" / 50 mm 1,97" / 50 mm -

- Box over machinery & magazines: 1,50" / 38 mm

Forecastle: 1,50" / 38 mm Quarter deck: 1,50" / 38 mm

- Conning towers: Forward 2,01" / 51 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm

Machinery:

Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,

Direct drive, 3 shafts, 23 171 shp / 17 285 Kw = 25,00 kts

Range 4 000nm at 12,00 kts

Bunker at max displacement = 704 tons

Complement:

301 - 392

Cost:

?0,381 million / $1,526 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:

Armament: 173 tons, 3,4%

- Guns: 170 tons, 3,3%

- Torpedoes: 4 tons, 0,1%

Armour: 897 tons, 17,6%

- Belts: 288 tons, 5,6%

- Armament: 75 tons, 1,5%

- Armour Deck: 522 tons, 10,2%

- Conning Tower: 13 tons, 0,3%

Machinery: 1 170 tons, 22,9%

Hull, fittings & equipment: 1 673 tons, 32,8%

Fuel, ammunition & stores: 592 tons, 11,6%

Miscellaneous weights: 600 tons, 11,8%

- Hull below water: 600 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:

Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):

6 455 lbs / 2 928 Kg = 122,4 x 4,7 " / 120 mm shells or 1,2 torpedoes

Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,30

Metacentric height 2,8 ft / 0,8 m

Roll period: 12,4 seconds

Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 82 %

- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,26

Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,65

Hull form characteristics:

Hull has raised forecastle,

a normal bow and a cruiser stern

Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,468 / 0,476

Length to Beam Ratio: 9,07 : 1

'Natural speed' for length: 21,12 kts

Power going to wave formation at top speed: 50 %

Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50

Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 15,00 degrees

Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m

Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):

Fore end, Aft end

- Forecastle: 25,00%, 22,97 ft / 7,00 m, 22,97 ft / 7,00 m

- Forward deck: 30,00%, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m

- Aft deck: 25,00%, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m

- Quarter deck: 20,00%, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m

- Average freeboard: 17,06 ft / 5,20 m

Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:

Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 99,2%

- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 134,7%

Waterplane Area: 14 220 Square feet or 1 321 Square metres

Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 116%

Structure weight / hull surface area: 74 lbs/sq ft or 362 Kg/sq metre

Hull strength (Relative):

- Cross-sectional: 0,94

- Longitudinal: 1,70

- Overall: 1,00

Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate

Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent

Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

скрыть

[SergeyM]

1908 года с ослабленной броней, машиной 1907 года, уменьшенной дальностью и доп. нагрузкой в 500 тонн.

Rion, Russia Cruiser laid down 1908 (Engine 1907)

Displacement:

4 589 t light; 4 790 t standard; 5 106 t normal; 5 358 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)

(452,35 ft / 446,19 ft) x 49,21 ft x (17,39 / 18,01 ft)

(137,88 m / 136,00 m) x 15,00 m x (5,30 / 5,49 m)

Armament:

10 - 4,72" / 120 mm 50,0 cal guns - 55,82lbs / 25,32kg shells, 300 per gun

Quick firing guns in deck and hoist mounts, 1908 Model

3 x 2-gun mounts on centreline ends, majority aft

2 x 2-gun mounts on sides amidships

4 - 1,46" / 37,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 1,56lbs / 0,71kg shells, 600 per gun

Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1908 Model

4 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread

Weight of broadside 564 lbs / 256 kg

4 - 18,0" / 457 mm, 19,69 ft / 6,00 m torpedoes - 0,927 t each, 3,706 t total

In 2 sets of deck mounted carriage/fixed tubes

Armour:

- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)

Main: 2,48" / 63 mm 262,47 ft / 80,00 m 7,87 ft / 2,40 m

Ends: Unarmoured

Main Belt covers 90% of normal length

Main belt does not fully cover magazines and engineering spaces

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)

Main: 1,97" / 50 mm 1,97" / 50 mm -

- Box over machinery & magazines: 1,50" / 38 mm

Forecastle: 0,98" / 25 mm Quarter deck: 0,98" / 25 mm

- Conning towers: Forward 2,01" / 51 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm

Machinery:

Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,

Direct drive, 3 shafts, 23 171 shp / 17 285 Kw = 25,00 kts

Range 3 000nm at 12,00 kts

Bunker at max displacement = 568 tons

Complement:

301 - 392

Cost:

?0,405 million / $1,618 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:

Armament: 173 tons, 3,4%

- Guns: 170 tons, 3,3%

- Torpedoes: 4 tons, 0,1%

Armour: 837 tons, 16,4%

- Belts: 216 tons, 4,2%

- Armament: 75 tons, 1,5%

- Armour Deck: 534 tons, 10,5%

- Conning Tower: 13 tons, 0,3%

Machinery: 1 317 tons, 25,8%

Hull, fittings & equipment: 1 762 tons, 34,5%

Fuel, ammunition & stores: 517 tons, 10,1%

Miscellaneous weights: 500 tons, 9,8%

- Hull below water: 500 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:

Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):

5 645 lbs / 2 561 Kg = 107,1 x 4,7 " / 120 mm shells or 1,1 torpedoes

Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,29

Metacentric height 2,7 ft / 0,8 m

Roll period: 12,5 seconds

Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 83 %

- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,26

Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,66

Hull form characteristics:

Hull has raised forecastle,

a normal bow and a cruiser stern

Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,468 / 0,474

Length to Beam Ratio: 9,07 : 1

'Natural speed' for length: 21,12 kts

Power going to wave formation at top speed: 50 %

Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50

Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 15,00 degrees

Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m

Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):

Fore end, Aft end

- Forecastle: 25,00%, 22,97 ft / 7,00 m, 22,97 ft / 7,00 m

- Forward deck: 30,00%, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m

- Aft deck: 25,00%, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m

- Quarter deck: 20,00%, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m

- Average freeboard: 17,06 ft / 5,20 m

Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:

Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 106,3%

- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 134,7%

Waterplane Area: 14 220 Square feet or 1 321 Square metres

Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 113%

Structure weight / hull surface area: 78 lbs/sq ft or 380 Kg/sq metre

Hull strength (Relative):

- Cross-sectional: 0,99

- Longitudinal: 1,81

- Overall: 1,05

Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate

Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent

Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

скрыть

[Vova7]

Вот он 1910-го года закладки с машиной 1908-го года

но нам нужен то все равно корабль такого класса в 1907 году вон немцы смогли же...

Бодицея

3300 - 3440/3800 - 4000т. 123,4x12,5x4,5 м. ПТ-4, 12 ПК. 18000Л.С. = 25 уз. 780-850 т уг.+190 — 200 т нефти. Броня: палуба 25 мм. Эк. 314-325 чел. 10 - 102мм/50, 4-47мм, 2 ТА 457 мм надв.

Бристоль

4800/5300Т, 138,1x14,3x4,7 м. ПТ-4(Бристоль ПТ - 2), 12 ПК. 22 000 л.с. = 25 уз. 1350 т уг.+1250 т нефти. Броня: палуба до 50 мм. Эк. 480 чел. 2 - 152 мм/50, 10 - 102 мм/50, 4 -47 мм, 2 ТА 457 мм подв.

Дрезден

4800/5300Т, 138,1x14,3x4,7 м. ПТ-4(Бристоль ПТ - 2), 12 ПК. 22 000 л.с. = 25 уз. 1350 т уг.+1250 т нефти. Броня: палуба до 50 мм. Эк. 480 чел. 2 - 152 мм/50, 10 - 102 мм/50, 4 -47 мм, 2 ТА 457 мм подв.

Майнц

4362/4915т, 130,5x14,0x5,58 м. ПТ- 2, 15 ПК, 31 000 л.с. = 26,7 уз., 1010 т угля Ч- 115 т не­фти. Броня: палуба до 50 мм, на скосах 80 мм, рубка до 100 мм, щиты 50 мм. Эк. 367 чел. 12 — 105 мм/45, 4 — 52 мм/55, «Кольберг» и «Аугсбург» после перевооружения в 1916 — 1917 гг. 6-150 мм/45, 2-88 мм/45 зен., 2 ТА 450 мм подв., на перевооруженных кораблях 2 ТА 500 мм палубные поворотные, 100 мин.

[SergeyM]

более слабая броня и вооружение. опять же позднее закладка. у вас есть данные сколь у них машины весили?

[Vova7]

у вас есть данные сколь у них машины весили?

на вундере быстро не нашел.. убегаю поэтому посмотрю попозже где нить еще...